Srimad Bhagavatam Lecture

SB.4.29.71, Brampton, Ontario, Lecture at Laxmi’s house

"Without Guru We Are Simply a Street Dog"

29.May.2005

Srila Gurudeva: Do you have a particular verse you are studying today or just any verse?

(Guru Mataji speaks with Laxmi Mataji in Hindi) Supti.

supti-murcchopatapesu
pran.ayana-vighatatah
nehate 'ham iti jñanam
mrtyu-prajvarayor api

Purport: Foolish people deny the existence of the soul, but it is a fact that when we sleep we forget the identity of the material body and when we awake we forget the identity of the subtle body. In other words, while sleeping we forget the activities of the gross body, and when active in the gross body we forget the activities of sleeping. Actually both states — sleeping and waking — are creations of the illusory energy. The living entity actually has no connection with either the activities of sleep or the activities of the so-called wakened state. When a person is in deep sleep or when he has fainted, he forgets his gross body. Similarly, under chloroform or some other anesthetic, the living entity forgets his gross body and does not feel pain or pleasure during a surgical operation. Similarly, when a man is suddenly shocked by some great loss, he forgets his identification with the gross body. At the time of death, when the temperature of the body rises to 107 degrees, the living entity falls into a coma and is unable to identify his gross body. In such cases, the life air that moves within the body is choked up, and the living entity forgets his identification with the gross body. Because of our ignorance of the spiritual body, of which we have no experience, we do not know of the activities of the spiritual body, and in ignorance we jump from one false platform to another. We act sometimes in relation to the gross body and sometimes in relation to the subtle body. If, by Krishna's grace, we act in our spiritual body, we can transcend both the gross and subtle bodies. In other words, we can gradually train ourselves to act in terms of the spiritual body. As stated in the Narada-pañcaratra, hrsikena hrsikesa-sevanam. bhaktir ucyate: [Cc. Madhya 19.170] devotional service means engaging the spiritual body and spiritual senses in the service of the Lord. When we are engaged in such activities, the actions and reactions of the gross and subtle bodies cease. (end of purport)

So we are reading about three different types of body. There’s the gross body this lump here. You see. Blood flesh, etc. Mustache, whatever. The gross body and there is the subtle body which becomes active in which we, we are very active in, in our dream state. Of course the subtle body is also active now. It’s the mind, the intelligence, and false ego. But now we are especially plugged in, in an awakened state of this gross body. And in the subtle platform, the dream state we are especially plugged into the subtle body, the mind, the intelligence and the false ego. But both states are dreams. This awakened state of thinking "I am this body" is a dream. The dream state of thinking " I am this subtle body" that is also a dream state.

In both states there are so many anxieties. So many anxieties occur in both states. If we want actual happiness we must come to the spiritual platform. The spiritual body; hrsikena hrsikesa sevanam bhaktir ucyate [CC Madhya 19.170] We have to come to that platform where we are simply engaged in Krishna consciousness. This Krishna consciousness process is so nice it reconnects us with our actual identity. Do you realize why you are suffering in this material world? Do you know why you are suffering here? You are suffering due to false identification with the gross body and false identification with your subtle body. That’s why you are suffering here. If you want to get out of suffering all you have to do is engage yourself under the direction of the bona fide spiritual master in the service of the Lord and then magic happens. You actually become situated in your spiritual body. Your spiritual body becomes revived. It’s been in a dormant state for millions and millions of lifetimes. You see.

After wandering through millions and billions of species; you see, sometimes a human being,
sometimes a demigod, sometimes a dog, sometimes a pig, sometimes a monkey, sometimes a
snake, sometimes a tree, sometimes a weed growing in the lawn that they cut. You see. So
many species of life we’ve been through. Some how or the other we’ve come to this human
form in due course of time and in that human form if you can come into contact with a bonafide spiritual master then by the grace of guru and Krishna the seed of bhakti will be planted within your heart. Now what you do with that seed, that’s up to you. Just like if I give you one very nice seed, Laxmi, to put in your garden. You see. You can neglect that seed. What will happen? It will die. Or you can water that seed very nicely and you can have a wonderful plant giving wonderful fruits and flowers. You see. So the spiritual master comes and he plants the seed of bhakti within your heart. Now what you do with that seed, that’s up to you. You can water that seed and what is that watering process? That is hearing and chanting the glories of the Lord. Especially chanting:

How much water does it take to keep the plant alive? At least sixteen rounds everyday. You
see. Anything less and the plant will die. If you can chant at least sixteen rounds everyday that’s enough water to keep the creeper alive. You see. You can chant more or you can engage in hearing and chanting in others ways by kirtan, by reading, by preaching and this will give more energy to that devotional creeper. But the minimum is you must do at least sixteen rounds everyday to keep the plant alive and you have to avoid the activities which will choke the weed up. They are called weeds. That’s why we have our principles; no illicit sex, no meat eating, no intoxication, and no gambling. Because these things if we indulge in them, they are weeds which will choke out that little creeper.

So therefore we strictly avoid illicit sex, meat eating, intoxication and gambling. And what else do we do? We build a fence around our garden. You know what that fence is? That’s to prevent us… that’s to prevent the mad elephant from coming into your garden. If a mad elephant comes into your garden he will go "Stamp, stomp ,stomp!" and you’re creeper is finished. They have those big feet, those elephants and they go (imitates sounds of elephants feet stomping) and everything’s finished. Your garden is finished if the mad elephant gets in. So you know what that mad elephant is? That’s when you criticize guru or you criticize Vaishnavas. You have a ….If you have a bad attitude against the guru, a bad attitude against the devotees then that’s the mad elephant that comes into your garden and just destroys everything. So we have to always worship guru and we have to always worship the Vaishnavas. Anande bolo hari bhaja vrndavan sri guru vaishnave pade majiya man [Nama Sankirtan] Ecstatically chant Hare Krishna, worship the Holy dham, Sri Vrndavan and always meditate with love on the lotus feet of your spiritual master and the Vaishnavas because this will prevent us from having our creeper stomped out by the mad elephant. Hati-mata, the mad elephant offense. So if we do this simple program once we come into contact with Guru who will plant that seed of bhakti in our hearts. If we then will chant Hare Krishna mantra:

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare
Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare

And follow these wonderful regulative principles of freedom which liberate us from unlimited
anxieties actually. If we will follow this simple program then our spiritual body will become
revived and you will no longer feel that you are that aging, gross body that is full of so many
pains. You see. Or that subtle body which has so much mental disturbance. You see. You will actually feel yourself as that spiritual body engaging in the service of Krishna which is eternal. Do you realize that at the time of initiation that one actually enters into immortality? When you take initiation from the bona fide spiritual master you actually revive your eternal identity. You are now living in your spiritual body performing spiritual activities eternally. If you stick… if you take initiation and you stick to your vows then you are living in immortality. Deathlessness begins at the moment of initiation. So it’s a very valuable thing. We encourage everyone to get ready and get initiated because that’s when your spiritual body actually becomes revived. That’s when you become resituated in your spiritual body when you become initiated.

So this is a very, very nice process and we encourage everyone to become pure devotees of Krishna. If you’re not a pure devotee of Krishna then you are doing nothing but cheating
yourself. You’re just cheating yourself. If you’re not a pure devotee, you’re cheating yourself.

Why? Because you’re causing yourself to suffer so many unnecessary anxieties. If you will
simply fully surrender yourself unto the lotus feet of Sri Guru and Sri Krishna, fully surrender
yourself under the authority of your Guru then you will find that you enter into the wonderful
dimension of consciousness where it is simply bliss at every second. Sweet unlimited nectar at every minute of your existence; from the moment you wake up in the morning until you go to bed at night and even in your dreams you will be Krishna conscious.

So we encourage you all to seriously take up this pathway of pure bhakti don’t loiter here in the suffering of Brampton, Ontario. Come to the transcendental platform. Live in Vrndavan at every minute with Sri Krishna. That is our request to you all. We appreciate very much how you are rising early and worshipping the Lord. This is wonderful, very nice thing. So now continue on in this way and make your life perfect.

Are there any questions?

(pause where no one asks questions)

Of course you know all the answers already don’t you? Therefore you have no
questions. You are already fully self realized liberated Vaishnavas, right? Dwija, you’re already on the liberated platform? Do you know everything already? There’s no questions. You see. Actually when the spiritual master is present, one should take advantage and think, "okay I have many, many obstacles in my heart at this present moment which are preventing me from achieving pure bhakti? So let me inquire from Sri Guru how I can remove those obstacles. You see that is how you should inquire. You should try to take advantage of the spiritual master’s association.

Guru Mataji: Oh, I have a question.

Srila Gurudeva: Okay

Guru Mataji: Okay you talked about obstacles. If I don’t want to remove the obstacle how can I remove?

Srila Gurudeva: That’s an obstacle itself.

Guru Mataji: How can we remove it?

Srila Gurudeva: If I don’t want to remove the obstacles. Let’s say I have the obstacles but I am happy with them. It’s like, it’s like you can take. You know the worm living. You every seen a worm who lives in the stool? If you take the worm out of the stool you know what he will do? He will go crawling back into the stool. You see. You give him a chance to release him from the disgusting life of living in the stool. And you say, "My dear worm I ‘m going to free you from the life of the stool." Of course you have to wash your hands after doing that. But then he goes crawling back in the stool because he doesn’t want to become free. He’s attached to his stool existence.

Guru Mataji: So how can we remove that?

Srila Gurudeva: So one, yes, So one may think, "Well, Gurudeva has come. He’s giving me a
chance to get free of my obstacles but actually I’m very attached to living in my world of
obstacles. I don’t really want to get out of it. So therefore I have no questions. I’m quite content and happy. Thank you. In my world of obstacles. But that means poor fund of knowledge. You don’t realize that death is coming. You see. At any minute death can come and take you away.

Guru Mataji: But how can we remove that?

Srila Gurudeva: Remove the….

Guru Mataji: Obstacles. The obstacles of the obstacle.

Srila Gurudeva: The obstacle of not wanting to get rid of the obstacles.

Guru Mataji: Uh’huh.

Srila Gurudeva: You have to realize that you’re in a….that what kind of precarious position you are in right now in this material existence; that any minute death can come. It’s a matter of intelligence. It’s, it’s a matter of becoming a little intelligent and maybe you’re not ready to become intelligent yet. Maybe you want to remain in illusion. But the material nature will arrange for you those opportunities when you can actually realize when…. For example the moment of death. But the best thing is to prepare yourself now. Don’t be attached to your bodily conception of existence. You may feel, "well,I’m quite happy in my bodily conception, I want to stay here." But you will not be allowed to stay in that bodily conception.

The best thing is to give it up voluntarily now in a peaceful happy way then to be forced out of it at the time of death. You see. You may be very attached to thinking I am this body, I am a Gujarati, I’m a….my bodily relations…I’m very attached to this identity and I’m very happy with it. But at the time of death you will be ripped out of it within a second. You see. I am the husband. I am the wife. I am the child. I’m this. I’m that. We may be very comfortable in these bodily identifications but, at the time of death it will all be finished within one second. And then you will be forced to take another bodily identification, another bodily one, after another one. So if one person who is your enemy in this lifetime, you may be forced to live with them as an intimate family member in your next lifetime as punishment for all of your sins of this lifetime.

You see. So we have to be intelligent and realize that if we don’t take advantage of the
opportunity to become Krishna conscious we are actually putting or setting ourselves up for so many varieties of suffering in the future.

Guru Mataji: But if one is intelligent they will realize the obstacles. But if I don’t think they are obstacles then…

Srila Gurudeva: Then the material nature will come and take us away from it. We may feel very comfortable but then all of the sudden a horrible traumatic experience of death will come and we’ll be forced to get out this position and according to our karma we’ll take up another position of illusion within this material existence and again be forced to suffer in so many ways.

Guru Mataji: How can we remove that, again?

Srila Gurudeva: You have to want to. You have to have the desire to get free from illusion. If you are quite happy to remain in the state of illusion then Krishna will facilitate you. He will let you remain in illusion. What do you think Dwija am I right or wrong? Am I right or wrong? So if you want to be in illusion Krishna will allow you to stay in illusion , you see, and if you want to come out of that illusion then Krishna will facilitate you coming out of it. So one has to decide, I’d rather be in illusion and experience a very limited degree of happiness mixed with so much unhappiness and anxiety or I’d rather have unlimited happiness completely free from illusion and anxiety. You have to decide what you want. So what do you want Laxmi? Do you want, do you want limited happiness mixed with so much suffering or do you want unlimited happiness?

What do you want ? Tell me.

Laxmi: I like to be free from this world, but I have to….

Srila Gurudeva: Do you want limited, do you want suffering?

Guru Mataji: She says she wants to be free from this world, but there is a big but.

Srila Gurudeva: But what? But what? What’s the but?

Laxmi: I can’t continue the chanting and this and that.

Guru Mataji: I can’t continue chanting.

Srila Gurudeva: Can’t? Huh? She cannot continue chanting?

Guru Mataji: Yeah

Srila Gurudeva: Why not? Why can’t you continue chanting?

Laxmi: I’m trying and missed again, I’m trying and missed again.

Guru Mataji: She says I’m trying and I fall again, I fall again, fall short.

Srila Gurudeva: Do you have a hard time eating?

Laxmi: No.

Srila Gurudeva: Do you miss eating?

Guru Mataji: Not only is she eats but, she feeds everyone else as you can see.

Srila Gurudeva: So not only are you able to eat but you are able to make sure everyone else is eating also. So if you can eat….it takes so much endeavor for eating. You have to go to the grocery store. You have to buy the vegetables. You have to make the money to buy the vegetables. You have to get into the car and go to the store and take the shopping basket go up and down the aisles. It’s such a big endeavor, just to eat. You see. Cooking, spicing, stirring the vegetables, you know, serving it onto the plates, washing the dishes. It’s a huge endeavor but, you still eat every day don’t you? Even though it’s so hard, all the work. You eat every day very nicely.

Srila Gurudeva: What can we do? We can lead a horse to the water but we cannot force the horse to drink. We have explained everything to you but, if you do not take it; what can we do? We are traveling and preaching all over the world to give everyone the opportunity to come to the liberated platform of Krishna consciousness. Some take it, some don’t . Those who take it they get the advantage of going back home, back to Godhead. Those who don’t take it they remain caught up in samsara the wheel of birth and death and they have to suffer again and again and again. Lifetime after lifetime after lifetime. So if you are intelligent you will take this opportunity to become Krishna conscious.

Indian Gentlemen: I see so many people,

Srila Gurudeva: Huh?

Indian Gentleman: From the Krishna consciousness.

Srila Gurudeva: Yes, yes that’s right. So what is the question?

Indian Gentleman: My question is that.

Because so many people…

Indian Gentlemen: I am not saying that.

Srila Gurudeva: Because so many people

Indian Gentlemen: I am not saying that.

Srila Gurudeva: Krishna consciousness is not good enough?

Guru Mataji: Yeah that’s why they fall down.

Srila Gurudeva: That’s like, they fell down because Krishna consciousness is not good?

Guru Mataji: If Krishna consciousness is so good? I’m just.. (Indian gentlemen speaking in background) I’m putting my argument.

Srila Gurudeva: She’s putting…She’s not putting your argument. She’s putting her own argument

Guru Mataji: If Krishna consciousness is so good then how can anybody fall down?

Srila Gurudeva: If Krishna consciousness is so good then how can anybody fall down?

Guru Mataji: Yeah.

Srila Gurudeva: Actually nobody falls down who’s actually fixed in Krishna consciousness. The only people who fall down are the people who approximate Krishna consciousness, who don’t really get into Krishna consciousness. Someone who really gets fixed in Krishna consciousness does not fall down. You see. It’s only those who, who become, you know approximately Krishna conscious or pseudo-Krishna conscious that have difficulties. Anybody who actually becomes fixed in Krishna conscious they become, they achieve stages which come one after another. Sadhu sanga, first of all sraddha, faith, second of all sadhu sanga, association with devotees, thirdly bhajana-kriya, taking shelter of the guru and engaging in the regulated activities of devotional service then anartha-nivritti, all the dirt comes out of the heart, then nistha they become fixed up Vaishnava, then ruci they get a sweet, an incredibly sweet taste while chanting the holy name and engaging in Krishna’s service, and then ashakti that taste turns into an absolute addiction, and then bhava they have volcanic eruptions of ecstacy within the heart and then prema, they become resituated in their original relationship with Krishna. So any body who sticks to the pathway they actually don’t fall down.

Guru Mataji: So now the question is this now if Krishna consciousness is good but I do not want to fall down that’s why I don’t want to take up. I’m going forward but, I don’t want to fall down so I don’t take it up.

Srila Gurudeva: I don’t want… But you’re already falling down. You say well I don’t want to take it because I don’t want to run the risk of falling down.

Guru Mataji: Many times the people say that:

Srila Gurudeva: Therefore I’m not going to do it because I don’t want to fall down.

Guru Mataji I want to be sure that I will not fall down.

Srila Gurudeva: I want to make sure that I won’t fall down therefore if I’m not sure if I won’t fall down I’m not even going to try but, you’re already fallen right now. If you think being fallen is bad then why do you remain in your fallen position?

Guru Mataji: I remember that argument of Abhay Charan used to give me that.

Srila Gurudeva : So if being fallen is bad, you don’t want to fall then why are you fallen right now? You get out of your fallen position right now. That’s simple. Any other counter arguments of why people don’t want to. Why do people not want to surrender to guru? Do you know? Do you know any? Can you give any reasons why some people do not want to fully surrender to guru become initiated disciples? Give some reason.

Laxmi: Maybe they are busy in the material world.

Guru Mataji: Maybe they are busy in their material activities in the material world.

Srila Gurudeva: They are very busy. Material world means basically making money and spending money. That’s the meaning of material existence. Make money and spend money. But in the middle of making money and spending money again I bring the point; do they give up their eating? No. Why? Why they don’t give up their eating? Why people don’t give up eating? They have. People are very busy. Material life means make money and spend money. So why they take time out to eat. Why they do that? Tell me.

Guru Mataji: Eating is essential.

Srila Gurudeva: No,no I am asking her.

Guru Mataji: Oh, I’m sorry.

Srila Gurudeva: Why do they eat?

Laxmi: They don’t want to starve.

Srila Gurudeva: They don’t want to starve. So as we were mentioning earlier the gross body requires food to survive, that’s alright. So your subtle body, I mean, your spiritual body actually also requires food for your survival. So why put all your energy into the temporary material body? Why not put some of your energy at least into your eternal spiritual body? You see. Busy with material life they still they don’t neglect their material body. Making money, spending money they still take time out to feed their body and to go take sleep at night because the body requires.

So you have to see your spiritual body also has requirements. In whatever, what’s the use of being so busy, busy, busy busy, busy in this material world when tomorrow the whole thing will be finished. Tomorrow you will be forced to not be busy anymore at the time of death. Where did your busyness get you? It got you into a cremation fire, that’s all. That’s were all your busyness got you. You’re now in the… you’re laying down for a nap in the cremation fire. That’s where all your busyness got you. So try to do some busy….That sort of busyness will take you to the cremation fire. Why not take the other kind of busyness which will give you an eternal life full of bliss and knowledge? This is intelligence. You see. Take up that busyness which will get you an eternal life full of knowledge and full of bliss. That is intelligence. This is the one class.

Actually we’re going to go give class at the temple tomorrow, the next two mornings. So this is your one Bhagavatam class. Take full advantage today. You can ask as many questions as you want because this is the one class you are going to get this year.

Guru Mataji: We talk about..

Srila Gurudeva: This is it. Once a year, Bhagavatam. Yes?

Guru Mataji: We talk about we are busy with material activities. Yeah, we make ourselves with activities which are even not needed. Food we may need for the body. But there are certain things, material activities which are not even needed for the body and we are busy with those things.

Srila Gurudeva: You mean like going to Disney World?

Guru Mataji: No, something like watching the television.

Srila Gurudeva: Oh, watching television. Oh yeah we have so much time. I remember one lady said, "I don’t have time to chant my rounds." I said, "Well, do you watch television? " She says, "Oh yeah I have some shows I have to watch every evening." You know I spend two hours every evening watching my favorite shows but, I don’t have time to chant my rounds.

Guru Mataji: Reading the newspaper and all those things.

Srila Gurudeva: Yeah, so.

Guru Mataji: Those are not even food. Making money is one thing. Making money is needed. Eating prasadam, food is needed.

Srila Gurudeva: Yeah.

Guru Mataji: But all these excessive unnecessary things.

Srila Gurudeva: Yeah that’s right. That’s right. That’s a fact. How much? We ask you? Well you say I’m so busy making money I don’t have time to chant. Well how much time do you spend at your job anyway? How many hours a day? Well ten hours a day, someone may say. But including my commute time it takes me ten hours a day to earn my living. Okay. How many hours in the day are there?

Guru Mataji: Twenty-four.

Srila Gurudeva: There’s twenty four. So that leaves fourteen hours. Now how much time do you need to sleep? Well some may say..

Guru Mataji: Six,seven.

Srila Gurudeva: Well, eight hours. I sleep a lot. I sleep eight hours. So that’s eighteen plus ten that’s eighteen that’s six. That still leaves six hours. You see. And how much time does it take you to eat, to take your meals and to take your bath? Well, I take two hours. I take, you know, an hour for my meals, a half hour for breakfast, half hour, an hour and a half let’s say for three meals. That still leaves four and a half hours. You see. And that’s plenty of time to chant sixteen rounds. It’s a matter of making your priorities. There’s actually plenty of time, even if someone is working ten hours a day, even twelve hours a day, there’s still enough time for them to chant sixteen rounds. It’s just a matter of realizing the absolute necessity of taking shelter of Krishna and doing it. It’s just a matter of realizing the necessity and putting aside other frivolous activities which are not helping me to advance in Krishna consciousness. We have to be willing to give up frivolous activities that are wasting our time and focus on Krishna. That’s the reality. You may not want to take it but, you will have to take the cremation fire. So I’m coming today to save you from the cremation fire. What…Do you want to be saved from the cremation fire or do you want to just surrender to the cremation fire? That’s my question. What do you want? Do you want to be liberated from the cremation fire or do you want to just have a nice nap in the cremation fire? What do you want? Your choice. I’m giving you an option now. I’m coming to save you from the cremation fire. Now you can take it or you can leave it. It’s up to you. I’m not going to force you. You have to give your heart. I could say , " oh you have to become initiated." I could give you… I could make you sit down for the yajna. But that’s meaningless unless you’re giving your heart. Unless your giving, actually giving your heart out of your own free will. Simply telling you to sit down in the yajna has no meaning, has no meaning whatsoever. I don’t want such disciples, artificial disciples. I want someone who is really serious to get out of the cycle of birth and death and that person can be initiated.

And oh by the way I’m…this is a special announcement. We’re inviting. I’m doing a yajna. I’m initiating three disciples in Montreal next Saturday at four o’clock in the afternoon. You’re invited to come and attend the yajna. If you want to come up and see the Montreal temple and see we’re initiating three disciples. This Bhakta Scott is becoming initiated and there’s one, two other ladies. One lady is coming up from Maine to become initiated and one girl who’s living there in Montreal is also becoming initiated. So if you want to attend you, you’re welcome to come to the yajna. The whole family can pack up and have a little outing, Montreal. Get out and see the… Get out of Toronto for a while and see the sites and see, come for the yajna next week. So anyway…

Guru Mataji: That’s it.

Srila Gurudeva: This is our once a year Bhagavatam class. We have to make it strong andheavy. Give you a good dose of the medicine, so hopefully you’ll recover from your dream state of thinking I am very comfortable in my illusion. Dwija, you think you are very comfortable in your illusion? Huh?

Dwija: I’m not very comfortable in this world. I’d like to come to the Krishna consciousness.

Srila Gurudeva: Any other questions?

Bhakta Scott: Srila Gurudeva?

Srila Gurudeva: Yes?

Guru Mataji: That would be a good reason. That would be a good reason not to get married.

(laughter)

Srila Gurudeva: Of course you’re a brahmacari, this is a bad example but, I’m just. This is…still the marriages are going on why? Because they find a suitable girl or a suitable boy and they do get married and they have happy marriages. So the point is just because some gurus turned out to be bad doesn’t mean that every guru is bad. Just like even, probably a better example is this if you ever have gotten a counterfeit note, I mean I haven’t but I am sure it wouldn’t be a very happy experience. You know you get a counterfeit note and it has no value, it’s like getting ripped off, cheated. So there is counterfeit money circulating in the economy, that’s a fact. Now does that mean that all the money is bad? Counterfeit money means somewhere there is real money which is the imitation.

Guru Mataji: So I won’t deal with the money.

Srila Gurudeva: You say well I got some counterfeit money therefore I won’t deal with money, period. Well you won’t be able to function in society without money, I’m sorry. The modern day society you, unless you’re a completely self-sufficient farmer, but, even then you’ll end up dealing with money. You’ll have to pay taxes on you property. You’ll have to somehow get money to pay the taxes. You cannot avoid dealing with money in this society. So just because there’s counterfeit money out there doesn’t mean you have to, now you have to give. So there are counterfeit gurus, I agree. I was initiated by a counterfeit guru. I don’t want to mention his name here in this exalted assembly but I was… there was one bogus guru who initiated me as his disciple. So does that mean well I got cheated. Actually I was a siksa disciple of another guru who cheated me and.. So I mean I went through a number of gurus who didn’t properly guide me. I took siksa from several of them and I took diksa from one and none of them actually gave me the actual position or the formula for becoming liberated. So this argument that well there are so many gurus, so many bogus gurus out there, therefore I won’t get initiated. It’s a bogus argument. It’s like saying there’s so may counterfeit dollars out there, therefore I will not deal with money. No, you have to have intelligence. You have to have discrimination to distinguish between who is a bona fide guru and who is not. Guru is required.

Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum evabhigacchet samit-panih srotriyam brahma-nistham
(MU 1.2.12)

Tasmad gurum prapadyeta jijnasuh sreya uttamam
(SB 11.3.21)

Guru is required. Without guru you are nowhere. Actually you are simply nowhere without spiritual master. You’re a street dog. We see if the dog has a master he’s in a very good position but, if he has no master he’s a street dog. In India the street dogs are in a horrible position. There bodies are all mangy. There bodies are all wounded from dog fights. They have other dogs who’s going to be the supreme dog on the block. The street dogs are in a horrible situation. People throw rocks, get away from me. So without a guru you are simply a street dog, that’s all. You’re simply a street dog. Master is required for a dog to be properly situated. So for the person…One has to have a guru otherwise you are nowhere. You are not making, you are not connected with Krishna. Prabhupada explains that without initiation there is no connection  with Krishna. Guru is the connecting link with Krishna. So we have to have guru. But you have to, you have to become learned to understand what is the bona fide guru and what is not so you can carefully choose that person who is a qualified spiritual master and not be misguided by the counterfeit gurus, which’s there’s so many nowadays.

Guru Mataji: Ok.

Srila Gurudeva: Any other questions?

Guru Mataji: We have to get ready.

Srila Gurudeva: We have to get ready?

Guru Mataji: Because eleven o’ clock is the program. We have got three hours.

Srila Gurudeva: What time are we leaving?

Guru Mataji: Maybe around ten o’clock.

Srila Gurudeva: We’re leaving here at ten in two hours.

Guru Mataji: Yeah